From Tanzania To US Navy Master Chief Culinary Specialist!

She shows up in Maryland at 21 with big dreams, a Tanzanian upbringing, and a problem a lot of immigrants recognize instantly: the U.S. system does not always “translate” your education the way you expect. Nelle Kigembe turns that moment of confusion into action, and within months she’s taking the ASVAB, shipping to Great Lakes, and learning English while learning Navy language. The result is a 22-year journey that ends with her retiring as a U.S. Navy Master Chief Petty Officer.

We trace the whole arc, from joining alongside her sister and pushing through boot camp challenges like the swim test, to ship life on USS Kearsarge, the post-9/11 operational shift, and how citizenship opened doors at exactly the right time. Nelle breaks down what leadership really looked like on a DDG when she had to learn the expectations beyond culinary specialist work, qualify, stand watches, and earn trust in a culture that sometimes “teaches” by pressure instead of explanations.

Then we get into the part every service member should hear: personal finance and retirement planning. Nelle shares how credit card mistakes and debt can quietly follow you, how consolidation and better habits gave her breathing room, and why she now focuses on financial literacy for active duty, veterans, and military families. Her favorite lane is protection: protecting income, protecting a family’s legacy, and understanding the difference between a will and a living trust so your plan actually works when it matters.

If you got value from this conversation, subscribe, share it with a shipmate, and leave a review so more military and veteran listeners can find it.

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Transcript

Welcome And Meet Nele

Gary Wise 0:19

All right, everybody. How are you doing? Once again, it's Gary Wise here. Words from the Wise Podcast. The intro, I'm kind of playing with it a little bit. I'm not quite sure what it's going to be like in the future. Uh, but things are growing. We're getting bigger, we're getting better, and we're just trying to grow, right? So I'm playing with it a little bit. It caught me off guard. It was the first time today. So thank y'all for being here with me. Thank you for listening to the sound of my voice and just coming back to spend some time again with the words from the Wise podcast team, you know, today. Ladies and gentlemen, today, uh, anyone listening to the sound of my voice, to the students, to the parents, to the people that are finding the podcast, I want to tell you that if you found the podcast today, you found a good episode. Uh, I've got a fellow Navy veteran. She's a retired United States Navy Master Chief Petty Officer. She served for 22 years in the Navy. And what's funny is we've never come across each other in person, but literally I saw her content start popping up on my feed because she recently retired and she's starting a business in the financial sector. And we were just communicating it back and forth. And I was like, Oh, I got I would love to have you on the podcast, share your story. She agreed. She goes by the name of Nele Kagimbe. And Nele, I would like to welcome you to the show. How are you doing?

Nelle Kigembe 1:40

Oh my brother, thank you so much. I'm doing a fabulous. It's so good to be here. Thank you so much for this opportunity. I'm very grateful.

Gary Wise 1:51

Thank you so much for taking the time and joining us and sharing your story. You know, I believe one of the most important things we can do is share our history, our story with people so they can connect, they can they can relate, maybe even they can get some wisdom. You know, chiefs, right? That's what we do, right? Heritage. We want to share with people. So thank you for taking the time.

Nelle Kigembe 2:12

You are welcome. Exactly. I'm here for you, so let's get started.

Tanzania Roots And Coming To America

Gary Wise 2:17

Let's go. All right, Nelly. So, question where did you grow up?

Nelle Kigembe 2:22

Oh, thank you for that, Gary. I am uh originally from Tanzania, East Africa. So Tanzania is um is the country where people go to see Mount Kilimanjaro. Sometimes people go over there to the islands of Zanzibar because Tanzania has a mainland and it has uh the island side is Zanzibar. So I grew up in a mainland side in the major city, one of the major cities called Darisalaam. So I was born there, raised there, but my dad was always being relocated for work back and forth to the other part of Tanzania regions. So I got privilege to travel in other countries, other regions part of the Tanzania. And then uh when I got 21 years old, my somewhere in between my mom and dad uh they separated, and my mom came to America. So when I graduated from high school, I went two years of college in Tanzania. Then when I was 21, I came over here to the United States to reunite with my mom to get alongside with my other siblings. So it was four of us who came to America.

Gary Wise 3:32

Okay, and were you the oldest of the siblings?

Nelle Kigembe 3:35

Yes, I'm the oldest.

Gary Wise 3:37

Well, I could see, I was thinking about that, right? I was like, okay, she's 21 years old, she's done two years of college. Like you could start your own life in Tanzania if you wanted to, but then when you brought up your siblings, I thought, okay, she's going, she wants to help them and their transition to the states because that's a pretty significant culture shift, right? You go from and where where was your mom in the states?

Nelle Kigembe 4:02

Uh she you she was in Maryland in Maryland, yes.

Gary Wise 4:09

Boy, it snows in Maryland.

Nelle Kigembe 4:11

Oh, yes, it does, and that was the one of the first culture shock because I never saw snow until when I came to America.

Gary Wise 4:21

I'm sorry, I'm you know what? I'm gonna go ahead and just I'm thinking in my head, I'm thinking of coming to America, Eddie Murphy coming from Africa in New York City in the snow. Like, what in the heck is this? Like, exactly. I can see you and your little brothers. Now, do you have little brothers and sisters, or what?

Nelle Kigembe 4:38

Yes, yes. So I'm the oldest, and uh my sister is four years younger than me, and then I have um my brother and my youngest brother. But the funny part is, is like uh all out of those four, three of us have served, and only one didn't serve, yeah. So my sister and I we served in the navy, and then my youngest brother, he's currently in a space force.

Gary Wise 5:05

Very what why do you think that is? Why do you think I've got my entire family? I've gotten a few cousins that might have joined like the reserves, very few people serve to have three people out of four serve country. There's something's going on, like they just get from you like that's a really good idea, we're gonna go do it, or what was what do you think caused that?

Nelle Kigembe 5:29

Yeah, so for in our family, I think I'm the cause, right? Because uh, when my mom left Tanzania, I was 13, and my youngest brother was two years old, so I became a mother or figure to my siblings. Yeah, and in an African culture, when you are the oldest, right? When you act as a parent, the the siblings obey you, they look out to you. So even when we came to the United States, um when I joined the Navy, it wasn't part of the plan, but eventually when I joined the Navy, and I'll share that a little bit how it happened. My sister, who's four years younger than me, was 17, but just graduated high school and she said, I want to go with you. Okay, you know, so and then my youngest brother, after he finished high school, he joined the Air Force, and then later on he converted to Space Force. So they're all like a following this big steps where the big sisters doing, kinda okay.

College Transfer Shock Sparks A Pivot

Gary Wise 6:32

But you so was the immigration was it complicated? Because there's all this conversation about immigration, but I mean, you guys are coming from Tanzania, East Africa. Did your mom come over because she was married to someone? Was she connected to somebody, or did she just wake up one day and say, I want to go live in Maryland now? Like, how does that work?

Nelle Kigembe 6:53

You you know, I don't know, because everybody has their own stories how they got here, right? My mom, she got she, you know, I think she got some kind of a green card, um, lorry winning to where she was here, right? And then uh so when we came here, we were already permanent residents, you know. So my yeah, my situation is different from others because when I got here, I was like, you have a right, either you can live here or you cannot live here. So we were like, okay, it's been so long since we, you know, we separated from our mom. And then uh for me in particular, yeah, I I wanted to continue with university, but there's a big uh education differences between what we learn in Tanzania and what we learn here in the United States, and they couldn't take all my uh credentials from college. And I thought I was doing good back home because uh at that time, two years of college, I majored in science project, I majored in physics, chemistry, biology. So I was like, I want to be a doctor, I want to continue with this, but then they couldn't really take it, and they said, Oh, you have to you have to repeat some classes, you know, and I didn't really understand that process, and it was confusing. So for me, I was like, man, I need to help my mom because I knew my mom, I thought my mom was doing well, but after we came in, she had to pick up a shift, you know. Now she's responsible for four of us, so I knew I needed to help my mom, and I was like, um, this schooling thing is kind of like not clear, you know. So this, yeah, so in a way, when I was watching a TV, I saw the commercial, and the commercial wasn't saying the navy, it was talking about the marines, right? Hey, if you join if you join them, yeah, if you join the marines, you can go to college. So I asked my mom, what you know, is it okay if I can join the marines? And my mom said yes, call them. And I was like, No, no, no, my English is not good, I don't want to talk over the phone.

Gary Wise 9:01

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was gonna ask you about that. I was gonna ask you about the language barrier. Did you come here? What what you what was your native language back in Tanzania? Swahili. Swahili. So now you come to America, and I'm gonna tell you what, I think your mom did an amazing job. That's how you guys got the the ease of coming into the states, right? Whatever your mom did, she probably just did a great job. That's my personal opinion. After living the life that I've lived, meeting all the people that I've met, that just doesn't go that smooth unless somebody really does a good job laying the groundwork, right? So shout out to your mama, right? Because she she she did a she got you guys access to some opportunities, and then you got the choice do you do it or not, right? Well, that's amazing. But then you get to the states, you start thinking, so I can see where college possibly doesn't transfer over because we we know how colleges are, they want you to pay them more money, right? And then unfortunately, not all colleges are the same, right? I I can do an online math course, and I may not get as good of an educational experience as somebody who's living at a university and doing it at that place, right? Yeah, um, and when I was a recruiter, I would recruit people from other countries and they would review their transcripts and they would give them essentially credit, right, for their education. And the people would always be a little bit frustrated because they didn't seem to get the same level of credit from their home country as they thought they should, right? But it's just there's some sort of a translation that doesn't always factor into that, so I could see where you're dealing with that, but you know what? At some point you learned how to speak enough English to get through the interview, and you passed the ASVA.

Nelle Kigembe 10:46

Miracles.

Gary Wise 10:49

Okay, so let's talk about that, right? So, how long were you actually in Maryland when you got this idea that I might want to talk to the Marine Corps?

Nelle Kigembe 10:59

Actually, um, I was in Maryland for about six months.

Gary Wise 11:03

Oh, quickly. Yeah, quickly. You got there quickly and you recognized that something needed to happen.

Nelle Kigembe 11:08

Yeah, something needed to happen. I was because that you know, like um when I was back in Tanzania, the two years of college was boarding school. So I was so used to study, study, study. Like I'm in a boarding school, you know. But um, now that I'm here in America, I'm in a house. And I'm like, what am I gonna do? You know.

Gary Wise 11:30

Right, right, right.

Nelle Kigembe 11:32

So I'm searching on the internet for schooling, I'm trying to educate myself. I didn't really grasp it. So six months later, I'm like, I needed to do something to help my mom. If going to school is not it, um, maybe I needed to get a job, you know, like those kind of things. And in Tanzania, we do speak English and uh we we learn English at school, you know, but uh you know, but um the actual language is Swahili. English is more like official language use, you know. So my English, like yes, I could read in English, but I couldn't like talk this smooth with you, Gary. You know, right. Yeah, I used to think like uh people are speaking so fast, like I needed to slow down, process it, then translate it, then speak it. So it was like a gap when someone was communicating with me because my brain was trying to do all those things, you know.

Gary Wise 12:26

Trying to translate it, right? Yeah, my wife is a Spanish speaker, right? And she tells me that sometimes she literally has to like transition from the Spanish translation in her head back into the English translation. So I and look, we've been around enough people in our journeys that we've met people that speak multiple languages, and so I totally can uh relate to that, and like in Japan, they learn English their whole educational experience, but they don't they they typically are not comfortable enough speaking English with you because they're afraid to be embarrassed or afraid to not do something correctly, so there's a little bit of a barrier there. So I can but that is an advantage to you though, coming in. You already can probably understand it, hear it, maybe even read it to a certain extent. Um so when you go to the so when you bring up in the military, are your younger siblings okay with that, or are they like nervous that you're leaving them and you're like their mother in this new crazy world called Maryland?

Nelle Kigembe 13:27

I truly don't know, right? Because uh my youngest, youngest brother, by the time we got here, he was 10 years old, yeah, so he was still like missing the mommy, mommy love. So I don't think he cared much, right? Okay, because he was a baby. Then the brother after that, after the youngest, um, he's two years older from the from my youngest, so he was into mama mama mode. So, like, I don't think he cared much because now they finally here with their mom, right?

Gary Wise 13:57

Okay, and then your 17-year-old sister, she was kind of interested in what you were about to do. Yeah, okay, correct.

Nelle Kigembe 14:04

My 17-year-old sister, she didn't really express it until after she saw me talking to recruiter. Then she's like, I want to do that as web too. Okay, you know, okay, and and oh, I was gonna say, and the way it happened is after I saw that commercial, my mom was like, Hey, you can give them a call, actually.

Recruiters, ASVAB, And Choosing Navy

Nelle Kigembe 14:25

And I was like, No, I don't want to talk. So my mom was like, You can also go online and put application online, so that's what I did, and I applied for Marine Corps because that's the commercial, yeah. Yeah, at the time I didn't know there were other branches, all I knew was marine co, you know.

Gary Wise 14:46

Yeah, it it's you know, a lot when I was a recruiter, all of our officers were like at the same place, and you would quite often catch people that had no awareness to anything more than like the army. They they would think we were all like the army. Are you are you in the army? Are you in the army? And I'm like, No, I'm in the navy, like we go on the ships, and they're like, they wouldn't even know, right? And yeah, it's just people don't have either they don't pay attention or they don't actually consider what they're thinking or what they're saying, they're just kind of just saying words that don't really make sense, it's nonsensical, right? Or they literally could be coming from somewhere else and they have no awareness, right? All of the above could be true, and so and there's rules to recruiting where you're like you're not supposed to go after somebody else that's going to see somebody, right? And so you have to be like, Hey, are you going to talk with somebody? And if they say no, then they're fair game, right? They're gonna I'm gonna get you to join the Navy, right? Yeah, if they say no, they're fair game. So you want to go to the Marine Corps, or at least that's the commercial you saw. You put in the information for the lead. Uh do they call you up?

Nelle Kigembe 15:55

Yes, so they call up. I I don't know, I think they probably spoke with my mom, right? And then uh the marine corps lady came in, and we spoke, and she said, Who are you a permanent resident? I don't think you can join the marine. Let me go and check. So she left, and then uh the navy lady called, the navy recruiter called, and she and she came over, you know. My door was open, and uh, I told her about the marines, and she said, you know what? Actually, I'll go check too, and I'll let you know. Then the Air Force came, you know, it was the same story, but guess what? Here, while I'm waiting for the Marine Lady, because I was so sure the Marine Lady will respond first, because that's what I know, right? And then uh the Navy lady came back and said, Actually, I checked, actually, she came back so fast. I think a day later, she said, actually, permanent residents can serve, right? You know, and then we started talking about the navy, and I said, Oh, I do not know how to swim. So I was like, and she said, You grew up in Tanzania, you have Indian, the beautiful Indian Ocean. And I'm like, Yeah, I used to run away from my dad. Every time we go to the beach, I'll be running away from him. I was safe playing with the sand, so I didn't know how to swim, right? Yeah, but she said, Oh, you don't have to worry about to swim because guess what? We'll teach you how to float, you know, you'll have you will always have a life jacket, you know, and stuff like that.

Gary Wise 17:30

And I said, Cool. We're gonna teach you how to jump off this high tower. She sold that dream. So what year, what year was this?

Nelle Kigembe 17:43

It was in 2000 because I came in uh late November, November 30th of 1999. That's when I came to America. Okay, so this was April of 2000.

Gary Wise 17:56

April of 2000, yes. So you go to Asbab, you go to MEPS, you get into the processing, and how long until you actually get to ship off and go to basic training right away, right away. That's like they loved you, yeah, they loved you, you were gone.

Nelle Kigembe 18:16

Yeah, because I was ready, yeah. Yes, so I took the test, and then uh as soon as I was practicing for as verb, uh my sister said, Can I can I try the asvab too? And uh the Navy recruiter said yes. So she went and tried the asvab, and then uh I took the test, and then my sister took the test, and I told Nora, hey, when you finish taking the test, my sister is Nora. I'm like, they gave me all these jobs I didn't know, and I picked the food service because she asked me, What do you want to do? What do you like to do? And I'm like, pick one for me, and she said, You like how to cook? I'm like, Yes, I like how to cook, you know. So I got food service. I'm like, don't pick food service. I'm like, I want us to be able to talk what you do, what I do, because we are new in a country, we can exchange ideas, so don't pick food service. She went to take the test, and something the similar happened to her, and she said, I want food service, and I want to go in the same day my sister's going in. If not, I'm not joining. So we ended up joining together the same day. Yeah, no kidding. So you guys came in as MSs? It's MSs, and people used to think we were in a body program, but we were not in a body program.

Gary Wise 19:32

Okay, and so for everybody listening, MSs are mess specialists, they're now called culinary specialists in the Navy, right? But their job is to essentially be responsible for managing the the food, managing the ordering, the the stowage, the the onloading, the offloading. There's a lot that goes into food service. I will tell you what, like as a when I went through my CMC tour, the the my CS senior chief was one of the most important people to my mess because that was the heartbeat of the crew, right? Was the Mestex, and that was a very important job. So, but I also know it's a thankless job and it's a hard job, especially for the young MS. So, okay, so you're gonna be in the MS and you go to basic training.

Nelle Kigembe 20:20

When do you go to basic training? Man, I think the same April 25th that we shipped out April 25th, 1999.

Gary Wise 20:29

You said 2000. 2000. It's still, but you're coming from Maryland, which is cold, so you're going to Great Lakes, which is cold. Are you in the same boot camp division as your sister?

Nelle Kigembe 20:40

Yes, so when we got to boot camp, we were standing, she was standing in front of me. I was standing behind her, right? I always put up front, you know, and then they were uh dividing the divisions, so it just happened. We ended up in the same division, okay, which it was a blessing.

Gary Wise 21:00

Yeah, that look to have I went to boot camp with two brothers, and they were in my division, as a matter of fact, and they were their dad was an MS chief, right? And these were the first two Filipinos I ever met in my whole life. I thought they were I thought they were Mexican. I'm not gonna lie to you, like because their last name was Enriquez, Marlon and Mike Enriquez. Marlon, if you're watching this, what's up, bro? Marlon's a retired master chief now as well. Uh, and uh, but they were right next to me, and they were I remember being like, You guys are really brothers, and they were like, Yeah, and I was it was pretty cool that they had each other in boot camp going through that, so I could see where that was a unique that's a unique bonding period, right? For the two of you going forward. So, okay, so looking back on boot camp, how was your experience?

Boot Camp Language And Swim Hurdle

Nelle Kigembe 21:48

Let me tell you, first of all, I am grateful I had Nora. If not, I wouldn't survive. Okay, yes, because everything it was taking me long to adapt, you know. Simple thing like folding the t-shirts, folding the uniforms, right? I would always like get hit about it. And then my sister will be like, no, you gotta do it this way, press it down so it's nice and neat.

Gary Wise 22:12

So good for her.

Nelle Kigembe 22:15

Yeah. And um, and uh a lot of things were different actually for both of us. Language barrier, right? Because now we are learning English. We have people who are speaking the language, so it's a good thing, but then military comes with uh uh especially navy, comes with their with its own Navy terms. Now I'm already learning this is a wall. Now you're telling me that's a bulkhead, you know, right now I needed to use the word food often. Now is chow, you know what I'm saying? The bathroom I can understand, and the toilet, but now you're telling me this is ahead. I'm like, yeah, you can cause some confusion for someone who's learning, but those are words we needed to learn, navy words we needed to learn and adapt. So it was a little bit challenging in that aspect, right?

Gary Wise 23:11

Right, yeah, but uh that's yeah, it's very true. I tell my students, uh, one of the most important things we teach you at basic training is communication our way, even how to write things in a logbook, right? Remember that how you had to write the number eight a certain way, yes, right?

Nelle Kigembe 23:30

Like she's oh yes, yes, so it helped to have Nora there because if she picked up faster, she would come and teach me, or how to stand so correctly, she would come and teach me because somehow I was a little bit slower, okay. Yeah, and then uh uh the boot camp was good until when we did a service week.

Gary Wise 23:53

Okay, you didn't you didn't you didn't you didn't like working on the galley?

Nelle Kigembe 23:56

No, I didn't have uh opportunity to work in the galley because I didn't know how to swim. Oh, you had to go to swim school, yes, I was looking forward because I knew this is gonna be part of my job, so this is service week, I'm gonna get to experience it, and then they're like uh uh, you needed to pass how to swim or how to float, and then uh both my sister and I, we didn't know how to swim, she knows how to swim now. Um I still don't know how to swim.

Gary Wise 24:27

Well, the goal is to not get in the water, right?

Nelle Kigembe 24:30

That's the goal. The goal is to stay dry. I'm telling you, if there's some drills on the ship, that ship is gonna survive because I ain't getting in the water, and me too.

Gary Wise 24:41

Look, I always think about like your legs kicking, and like that's a lot underneath you. I don't want to be in the ocean. I'm good. That's why I was a damaged control man, and we're staying on the ship.

Nelle Kigembe 24:52

So I struggle, struggle in a service week because every day I was in that pool, and finally the instructor, my sister, passed, right? Like the second day she could float on a pool, that's why she passed. I couldn't, I couldn't figure it out. Every time I tried to float, I would sink, you know. So finally, like the very last day, uh, the instructor was saying, like, you don't float today, Kigembe, you're getting back, and I was like, I cannot go back without my sister. So I tried so hard that day, somehow I managed. I think if you put your mind into something, you can do it.

Gary Wise 25:34

Hey, so one question that I have is when you were growing up in Tanzania, did your family have a faith-based, like a religion or a cultural like observance that you guys followed along with?

Nelle Kigembe 25:46

Yeah, so Tanzania is divided into Christianity and Muslim. And uh the interesting part is my mom is Christian, my dad is Muslim. So I grew up into both.

Gary Wise 25:59

Okay.

Nelle Kigembe 26:00

Yeah, I grew up going to the mosque and pray, and I grew up going to the church and pray. I have families from both good sides of the world. Now I'm Christian, you know, so stuff like that.

Gary Wise 26:12

Well, because in boot camp, everybody finds faith, right? In boot camp, everyone wants to go to church, we all want to go to somewhere and get some peace. And I'm thinking about you praying, like, I need to pass this dang swim test today. Like, help me float, right? Yes, help me float because if I get separated from her, this is going to be horrible.

Nelle Kigembe 26:33

Okay, I was praying God.

Gary Wise 26:36

Yeah, so already, you know, number one, you you see this first, you come to a whole new country, which is, I think, already just awesome, right? And I'm a teacher, I teach high school ROTC, and so I'm always talking with my students about the opportunities that are going to be coming for them, and not to be fearful because it's time to go find out what's in the world, right? And here you are at 21 years old, coming from East Africa to Maryland. Now you see a commercial, you make a phone call just by taking that action. Now you start getting opportunities coming, right? And and you get to the Navy first for whatever the reasons, but now by you having initiative, your sister gets an opportunity because she rides with you, but then you find strength in her, which I think is super cool. Um, and then I see this swim thing, like you said, being a big hurdle for you to get over, right? And you were really struggling. So this is a big moment in your story that you passed that swim test. Okay, good check. And I love people's story because when you look back on your life, it is just so amazing that you got to where you are today, right? Let's be honest.

Nelle Kigembe 27:49

Absolutely, absolutely, right?

Gary Wise 27:51

And I have, yeah, yeah.

Nelle Kigembe 27:54

And another thing like about boot camp, I tell people we didn't Nora and I, although we passed the swim test, we also were sent back four weeks to the fast division. I don't know if you remember fast division. Was that to for to work on English? Yes, to work on English, so in a way, we were grateful, you know. Although people are like, You're gonna be in boot camp for four more weeks. Who wants to be in a boot camp four more weeks? Especially the times like our times when we were in boot camp, right?

Gary Wise 28:26

But it's a crash course in communication, and you know what? You're getting paid while you're there.

Nelle Kigembe 28:31

Yes, it was a blessing for us because we really like fast division, it was a little bit slower pace compared to normal division. So we really I got to understand how to fold clothes correctly, I got to understand how to do push-ups correctly because we had a little bit more time to practice. You know, I got to learn more of Navy language correctly, you know, and after that it was easy for us to excel.

Gary Wise 28:59

Good, good, yeah. So when you graduated boot camp, I doubt did your family come to boot camp to see you graduate?

Nelle Kigembe 29:07

No, my mom couldn't come at that time, so my sister and I we graduated together and then um we went to A school.

FAST Division And A School Growth

Nelle Kigembe 29:16

Okay, our A school was uh in Texas in uh Lackland Air Force Base, right? So we went okay.

Gary Wise 29:25

So you guys together flew off to A school, so you got to a chance to figure out the airport together, and but you had flown from Tanzania, then you'd flown from Maryland up to my first airplane trip ever was to boot camp, right? I had yeah, so that's a big deal for me, right? Flying on the airplanes is still a big deal for me because I didn't grow up flying on airplanes. Was your first airplane? Oh no, your dad had you flying all over the place in Africa, huh?

Nelle Kigembe 29:51

Yeah, so so that really helped us out because when my mom left, uh my dad uh he put us in a boarding school. My sister and I, we were in boarding school, you know, because boarding school in uh back in Tanzania is more structured, disciplined, kind of like a mini bootcamp type, the way I see, you know, because you don't have your parents there, you are there to study, so you're there. It kind of helped you to get that social skills early because I went to girls' boarding schools, so my sister went to a mixed boarding schools, uh, stuff like that. But um, because our dad and the school were in two different regions, so he would make an effort. One time you come home for vacation, he will get a flight ticket so you can experience to fly. Another time he'll put you in a on a ship so you can experience what the ship is like, or he will put you on a bus so you can go through the local bus. He wanted us to have that experience. I did the same thing to my son so he can have that experience early on.

Gary Wise 30:56

What does your dad know that you joined the military at this point?

Nelle Kigembe 31:00

I truly believe my dad didn't think I was gonna stay in America, he thought I was gonna come visit my mom, and then even if other siblings remain, I think he believed I was gonna go back because I just finished two years of college, I was accepted to a medical school, so he knew I was gonna come back. I thought I was gonna go back too, but then when I came over here, I was like, let me help my mom, you know.

Gary Wise 31:29

Yeah, okay. I just interested because you know your dad sounds like he played a big role in your life growing up, and I didn't know what his uh feelings were were gonna be about you joining the military in America and committing to going long term. So when you guys get to Texas, yes, how was Texas?

Nelle Kigembe 31:47

Because that's a lot different experience than Maryland, yes, different experience, beautiful city of San Antonio, right? But Texas in July, oh my Lord, it's hot like back in Tanzania, all over again. Yeah, yeah, yes, but it was beautiful. Um I did well over there. My sister did well. Actually, my sister did very well. She was uh, you know, like uh I don't know if they have nowadays, but back in the days when we go to A school, when you perform so well, you get the APO program, accelerated to petty officer third class program when you check into your command. My sister graduated the top of all of us mass management specialists, you know.

Gary Wise 32:34

I'm not surprised though. She was there, but you know what she had going for herself that you didn't have was she didn't have those years of college, uh-uh. She didn't have so she was a little bit more open to newer things where you had a little more experience, you had to unlearn, right?

Nelle Kigembe 32:51

Yes, I couldn't believe it. Like I tell people, like, I can't believe Nora's average was 100%. Yeah, and we were staying on the same barracks at night. I would be sitting, studying, right? Because we have tests, and this girl will be sleeping. And then when I when we take the test, I will end up with 80 something while she's scoring 100. I'm like, you were sleeping, I was studying. How is this possible?

Gary Wise 33:20

So, how long how long was MSA school? It was six weeks at that time. Okay, yeah, so I I I I asked this question because I will tell you there's no experience like the A school or your first your first school experiences in the Navy, right? Because you're young, you've got money, you don't typically don't have any responsibilities, you make friends with everybody that's showing up to go to school together, and you guys go out on liberty, right? Uh-huh. Were you guys able to go out for some liberty in San Antonio?

Nelle Kigembe 33:51

Well, yes, you would and then we were very simple because um we chose like some of our pay when we're going to help our mom. So we chose like, okay, we're just gonna stay simple. We will go explore, but we wouldn't do things everybody else will do. Us growing out, yeah. Maybe watch a movie that was a fun for us enough. Good for you. Eat something, yeah. Then let's get back on base.

Gary Wise 34:20

I was curious, I was I was curious, right? Because here you grow up in a this very interesting culture, coming from like you said, dad was Muslim, mom was Christian, but kids get wild in high school, right?

Nelle Kigembe 34:35

I think it could have like uh I look on a life, Gary, sometimes, and I said I had opportunity to become any vision of myself I wanted to. I chose to be me.

Gary Wise 34:48

Amazing, and you know, I didn't I did not have that enlightenment until I was in the Navy five years, yeah, right. I thank God every day that I survived the first three years, and there wasn't cell phones, and there wasn't video cameras, and there wasn't social media because I was ignorant as a young sailor, right? And I mean, I can relate well with a bunch of young wild kids, but sometimes I'm very, very fortunate. And so to hear you, but I'm not I'm also not surprised. I mean, you had your sister, right? To keep you guys focused, you've already got all this worldly experience, you grew up going to boarding schools, so you already had to be able independent from a young age to not just do bad things or not not do something that wasn't aligned with your values, right? True, true, very incredible, very incredible. So coming out of A school, your sister gets to pick wherever she wants to go, right? Because she's the top-tier person.

Nelle Kigembe 35:50

That was interesting because they told Nora, you get to pick exactly that anywhere you want to go. So Nora was like, Yes, I want to go to that ship, carrier, and then the carrier, I think it was either the Kennedy, one of the carriers, I don't remember the name, right? But it was in a in Florida, and they told Nora, you know what? Yes, we told you that, but guess what? You're not citizen, that is a nuclear power carrier. You have to be a citizen to get on board. And that Nora started crying. She cried so hard as if somebody gave her a bad news, right? Like as if somebody died in a family. That's how bad she was crying. Wow. And she said, This is not fair. You told me I can pick any ship, you know. She's 17-year-old who doesn't understand right what it means. Like, yeah, when you are citizen, there are some privileges. So, because of that, the instructors were very nice, and then they had to go and print USS Caesar, the ship, to show Nora, like, hey, this ship over here is not a carrier, but let me tell you, this ship is big. Now they are selling a dream for this girl who's crying weeping because she wants to have a carrier experience, right? Right, yeah, and uh, and then uh, so finally she's everybody's like, Oh wow, they actually need two females on a caseage. So the instructors are like, hey, I know Nelly is not number two and picking up all this class. Are you guys okay if Nora can go to the casage with her sister because they needed two girls? And the class was like, No, we don't mind. So I got the VAP pass, yeah.

Gary Wise 37:41

LHDs, baby, and baby. Yes, my first ship was USS Bellowwood, so LHA, so I can relate, right? I can relate, yeah.

Nelle Kigembe 37:52

So that that's how that processing ended up, and Nora stopped crying, she was happy because she she now she's gonna go to the ship with her sister, so I got lucky again.

Gary Wise 38:04

And so when you guys go to the Kearsarge,

Checking Into USS Kearsarge Life

Gary Wise 38:06

is it over there in Little Creek at the time?

Nelle Kigembe 38:08

It was uh right there at Norfolk at the time.

Gary Wise 38:11

Norfolk, so it was over there at Norfolk, yeah. So everybody, Norfolk, Virginia, the biggest Navy base in the world, all right. In the world, uh, so when you all get to Hampton Roads, do you just go straight to the ship and check on board?

Nelle Kigembe 38:26

No, so after we graduated, then we went home to Maryland, okay, and then our mom drove us uh to Virginia, so we got to see where the ship is because we were with our mom, we got to see where NEX is, so we did all that little tour in Hampton Roads, and then uh we checked on board. We were there like on a weekend, then the next day we checked on board, and um actually when we checked on board, the ship was not there, so they put us on a barracks waiting for the ship to come back. The ship was out to sea, and then the day the ship came, uh, we were on a pier with our dress whites uniforms, with our seabags, you know. We're like, wow, the ship is so big, right?

Gary Wise 39:10

And everybody says, Hi, nice to meet you. We're all going home now.

Nelle Kigembe 39:14

I know everybody was going home, you know. They got us situated, and then uh that's how our new life started. And at that time, you know, like if you when you were e4 and below, you stay on board, so they show us our racks, how to make it the racks we already made, so how to make it, and uh okay.

Gary Wise 39:35

That's what I was gonna ask you. So you guys lived on the ship your first couple of years, uh, or until you made e5, right?

Nelle Kigembe 39:42

Yes, so you know, the good thing is we checked on board, and then 30 days later, Nora was e4, and I was e1. No kidding, you were e1 even with your college, yes, because they the college couldn't really like the credits couldn't, yeah.

Gary Wise 40:01

And you were the older sister, but she was a petty officer, she was a petty officer. In the MS world, that's a big deal.

Nelle Kigembe 40:08

It's a big deal, and it's so funny. We were all the kigembe, and my first name is Nell, and her first name is Nora, and our middle name in in Tanzania, your middle name is your dad's first name. Okay, so all of us we have the same middle name because it's our dad's first name, which is Yasin, right? That's how the culture is. So Nora's initial is NYK, my initial NYK. So even boot camp, it was confusion. NYK, we're all NYK, so they had to separate us by social in bootcamp, but even socials, our last four are very close. Like I'm 5140, she's 5141. So people used to think we are twins.

Gary Wise 40:51

So when you look at that first ship, right? When you look at the Kearsarge, one thing I love about MSs is there's some there's some strong leaders in that community, right? Because they have to take all of the FSAs, all of the so just so everybody listening, all of the divisions on the ship have to pay a tax of manpower to help support the food service operation of the crew. The the MSs are there to be the the professionals that cook the food. That's like damage control. We're the firefighter professionals, but everybody has to help fight the fires, right? Everybody has to play their role. Well, food and laundry is very similar in that people typically have to come do some time helping out, and not everybody's happy about doing that, right? And so a lot of the MSs have to learn how to work with people that are not traditionally in food service and inspire them to want to do good. But what I found is there's a lot of good leadership in the food service officer community, in the chief petty officer community of the MSs, right? And in the supply corps period, like all of the supply chiefs are usually pretty good. When you look back on your first ship, did you have a good experience?

Nelle Kigembe 42:02

Your first ship, yes, it was very good experience because for once, like I say, Nora was already ahead of me in pay grade, right? And my goal was to catch up on her. I'm like, it's okay, buddy. I'm gonna catch up on you, right? So so that was a good experience. But guess what? Nora, when she took the E5 exam, because when you are E4 to E5, um, the requirement was only one year, then you take the test for E5. So when she took the E5 exam, which is mess management specialist second class, right? Right, she passed, she was selected.

Gary Wise 42:42

Yeah, first class. I'm not surprised. I'm not surprised. She already ever e swap spin too. Yes, I'm not surprised.

Nelle Kigembe 42:52

Yes, so now I'm like, Oh, you are making it impossible for me, you know. So my first class, who was our galley supervisor, was like, hey Nelly, you're gonna catch up with your sister because E5 to E6, the timing rate is three years. What you needed to do is when you get a chance to sit down for e4 advancement exam, you cannot fail. And when you get a chance to do e5, you cannot fail. That's how you're gonna catch up with your sister because she has a three-year gap. So I was like, cool. So I did exactly that. So when I left the casear, when we both left the case, I was e5 and she was e5, but she was e5, ready to take an exam for e6.

9/11 Deployments And Fast Citizenship

Gary Wise 43:37

Okay, but you caught up to her, but you caught up to her during your time on the Kearsarge, 9 11 happens, 9 11 happens, yes, indeed. And for our generation, that's a big trigger, right? That changes everything for the rest of our time, right? We're we're the global war on terror generation and We we did the whole thing, right? I joined in 97, you joined in 2000, but we were in before 9-11, but then we dealt with everything that came after that. So what for Curesarge, did you guys deploy in support of operations after 9-11?

Nelle Kigembe 44:15

We did actually, because I remember um I did a two-deployment on that ship. And one of it, yes, we had to go out right after September 11, right? And then uh the good thing I always um can say about the September 11 is um is uh I was able to get my citizenship quicker, myself and my sister. Our mastership master chief came and said, the Kikember sisters, you know, the rules have changed, you don't have to wait uh five years before you can get your citizenship. If you want, you can apply for your citizenship. So we call our mom, and our mom was like apply it right away. So we went, I think we went to see our career counselor, somebody guided us on how to put application, and we did, and we got our citizenship. So there were some other people on a ship in food service from different parts of Africa, they didn't want to do it, but we did, yeah, and I'm so glad that opportunity we took advantage of it because it opened so much doors for us.

Gary Wise 45:19

For sure. For sure. Did you get to do so? You probably did not get to do a deployment before September 11th, huh?

Nelle Kigembe 45:27

We we did, we did actually deployment before September 11th, and then we did another one after September 11th.

Gary Wise 45:36

So, how different were those two different deployments, right? The the Liberty ports and just the the force protection measures and just the feeling of being a part of this crew before because I my ships we would go to ports when before 9-11, and we would we would just have all kinds of fun after 2000, after 9-11, it was a lot more, we were a lot more cautious and a lot more concerned, and there wasn't as many ports, right? They were we're we were underway a lot more doing more operational things. Did you see that on your side as well?

Nelle Kigembe 46:10

Yeah, but at that time, to tell you the truth, Gary, although I noticed the difference, it did not matter to me because even before when we could enjoy the port, my sister and I were keeping so simple. So that simple life, it kind of took us to the next one. Although people were complaining to us, it was like kind of like okay.

Gary Wise 46:33

Oh no, so you know, I was that way. So my first ship, I was wild. When I went to my second ship, I was married, and I'll tell you what, I never left the ship. Yeah, you know, I because I didn't trust anybody, yeah. I not for nothing, you know, like I know, like it's my wife and I got together 2001, married 2002. We're still married to this day, right? Guess why? Because Gary never left the ship. I stayed my butt on the boat, right? Because and I got my college done and I got my education done, and you know, and it's in our community that's that's hard, right? Like it's hard, and so I can I understand you and your sister being locked in and focused and not letting yourself get distracted from some of the other stuff that was out there for young sailors. There's a lot of distractions, a lot, yes. So you guys are finishing up Kearsarge. Did you know you were gonna re-enlist, or did you ever consider getting out?

Nelle Kigembe 47:29

Yeah, so good question, right? I knew I was gonna get out, right? And uh Nora knew she was gonna stay and retired, like she loved it. I, on the other word, I was very clear why I joined the military was to go to school, and I couldn't go to school because of food service. We were carrying marines, we were uh continuous feeding, and uh, I was the leaders say the leaders that I was under, they said we were a breath of fresh air because everything they task us to do, the Kigembe sisters, we did it. Like I wasn't arguing why I have to switch from fryer to the grill to do this, I would just do it, you know. So for the leaders, it was like, man, everything we ask you to do, you do. We tell you get your pin, you get your pin. It wasn't even mandatory for us, but Nora and I we left that thing with the two pins, surface and air, right? And we advanced and we did everything we could, right? We have inspection, it was game on. What is expectations? We would do it, right? So it was kind of like a different experience for us. Okay, yeah. I don't know.

Gary Wise 48:43

I I I could see so why did you decide to stay in then?

Nelle Kigembe 48:46

Yeah, because uh after that, uh, thank you for reminding me. After that, I wanted to leave. So I told Nora I'm not gonna re-enlist because I needed to go to school and I couldn't go to school here. So when my master chief knew that I wasn't re-enlisting because of schooling, he said, Nelly, I want uh Kigembe, you needed to go and experience show duty for at that time. We were CSs, somehow along the way, our ring changed from mass management to culinary specialist. Oh, yeah, go to show duty and see how CS world is. And while you're on show duty, get your degrees, and then if you don't like, get out.

Gary Wise 49:25

Right.

Nelle Kigembe 49:25

Okay, so I said I'm gonna re-enlist. And then for it's so funny when we enlisted the Navy, they did a bonus. They said if you guys enlist for five years, we can get enlistment bonus. So we took the bonus to enlist, and then when we were re-enlisting, surprisingly, for our rate, they put a bonus again. So to me, I'm like, wow, God loves us, you know, like it just yeah, that's awesome. Yeah, so we end up um re-enlisting with a bonus, and unfortunately, my sister was pregnant at the time, so my sister stayed in Virginia, and I was all the way, my oldest were all the way to Neville Base, um,

Shore Duty Skills And Credit Wake Up

Nelle Kigembe 50:08

Bremerton. Now it's Neville Base kids up in Bremerton, Washington. So for the first time, we're gonna get separated, and I cannot do nothing about it.

Gary Wise 50:18

So for your so for your sister going through that life change of being in a relationship, becoming pregnant. Were you were you happy with for her, or was there a conflict there where you felt like she wasn't doing what you guys had been doing, and there was like she had kind of gotten into something with somebody?

Nelle Kigembe 50:38

I knew she was dating someone, right? But I was kind of disappointed because she's my baby sister, you know. Yeah, and I knew her goals, you know, and I was like, This is gonna slow you down, and it made me even sad that we're gonna separate. But for her, I didn't know she wanted us to separate. Oh, yeah, because because she needed her freedom, because now everything she does, she has this other mom here, and she used to tell me, like, you are you are just like mom, like everything I need my freedom, you know.

Gary Wise 51:10

Okay, well, there you go. Okay, because she grew up, right? She grew up, she grew up. So then here you go, you're off on your own. Now you're going to Bremerton, you're going to Bremerton or Bangor? To Bremerton.

Nelle Kigembe 51:23

So it's it's so funny because uh food service there. The Benga, they have food service, and Bremerton, they have food service, they have a small galley. So I'm checking into admin in Bremerton, and they say, Oh wow, you are your CS2. Hmm, let's send you in a galley to Benga. So, okay, figure out where Benga is. I end up in a benga. I'm checking in, and uh uh the FSO is like, you are CS2, we have so many CS2s in the galley. Maybe they might need you in the barracks, so you need to get back to Bremerton to the barracks. So I got back to Bremerton to the barracks, and there is Masichif, right? And Master Chief is looking at me and is like, let me have you a service record. So I'm giving him my record, he's reading, and he's telling the other CS2 that hey, I need CS2 kigembe to relieve you, so start doing tunnel. So I'm like, uh oh man, I don't know what's going on, right? So this other second class is telling me, like, you are not gonna stand master chief, man, you know, my nobody won't like to work with him, da da da da. But I'm like, I'm thinking, like, how worse can he be compared to my master chief on a case? So I'm like, in my head, I'm like, I'm so used to work with master chiefs, you know.

Gary Wise 52:42

Right, so yeah, but not everybody, yeah, not everybody has that experience as a young sailor getting access to a master chief, like you did on the Kearsarge, right? Like, let's be honest, the Master Chiefs, we we're both our former Master Chiefs, right? We're both we're both master chiefs, so we understand we you unfortunately cannot give everybody all your time, but if we see potential and we smell potential, which that master chief on the Kearsarge did, he invested in you. I guarantee when that master chief at that Bremerton base looked at your record, he went into his room and dropped to his knees and said, Thank you, God, thank you, God, yeah, because he he was probably sure duty's hard, right? Short duty's hard to get people to focus because, like the like the other master chief told you, everyone's going there with their own personal plan, but we still got a job to do.

Nelle Kigembe 53:39

Yes, yeah, because at that time I just finished my C2 or five years on a K Saj. I went from E1 to E5. I got my both pins, I got two names already, you know.

Gary Wise 53:51

Yeah, you're doing it.

Nelle Kigembe 53:53

I was sharp without knowing how sharp I was, right? Yeah, I was just doing my job.

Gary Wise 53:59

Doing it. So for that, did you do three years at did you stay at the barracks the whole time?

Nelle Kigembe 54:04

I stayed on a ship until when I picked up E5. Then I moved out. I was on uh I was my sister and I we took apartment.

Gary Wise 54:15

Okay, but when you got to Bremerton, did you always stay in the hospitality side or did you ever get back to the galley?

Nelle Kigembe 54:22

Uh-huh. So I got to Bremerton, I saw Master Chief, so we were on the barracks. Okay, so I got my apartment because it's show duty, and then uh I was admin petty officer, you know. So anything that goes to Master Chief, and he would teach me, which it was uh it was a great skills because he told me how the evils are, I needed to check the evils, anything that goes to him, what is he looking for? And I'm the first eye to make sure everything is good. So yeah, so it took me uh the first time, it took me putting a little bit long hours, which I wanted to do because I wanted to make sure everything that goes to Master Chief, there's no issues. So if I catch the issues, I just kick it back, correct it real fast because when we presented to Master Chief, nobody wanted Master Chief to be backing. So it was good. He told me administration skills, which ended up become very positive thing in a leadership when I grew up in a mess.

Gary Wise 55:23

I was about to ask you about that. So, two things I was a base CMC, I was Naval Base Guam Command Master Chief, right? And we have no galley in Guam, so I had no CS, so I was managing all the barracks for the base with civilians, and I will tell you, coming up through the mess, I loved CS that had, especially on the ship that had did in the barracks because they could better, especially. I mean an amphib, I was a LSD CMC. My CSCS could help me figure out logistics for where all the billeting was gonna go because they had that hospitality background from doing the barracks, right? And so I really regretted not having that experience when I was the base CMC. Luckily, I I'd gotten some from the ship, so I could see where I mean you've already got all the galley experience from the ship. Now you're getting the hospitality side from the barracks, plus you're getting access to just one-on-one time with Master Chief. So you're getting along a lot of grooming. Uh did you you're I know you're into finance now after your retirement? Did you start getting into financial things at this point in your career yet? Did you start learning about like did you go to college and did you start educating yourself like on TSP and financial stuff yet? Or is that not yet in your life?

Nelle Kigembe 56:45

Not yet, not yet, right?

Gary Wise 56:46

Okay, so it's coming. So it's coming. So did you get to go to school while you were on short duty?

Nelle Kigembe 56:53

Absolutely. I got to go to school, you know, and then uh, and my goal was still the same, not to make the Navy my career. Okay, I was I was okay, I'm here on short duty. My goal is to get these degrees and be out, right? Because now I want to get back to Virginia to help my sister. That's that was on my mind, yeah.

Gary Wise 57:15

Yeah, so okay, yeah, so okay, that's so you want to go back to Virginia, help your sister because now she has her baby, yes, and is it just her and her baby at that time? Yes, oh no, so she's probably worried about like family care plan and all that other stuff, right?

Nelle Kigembe 57:31

Uh-huh, correct. So I was in my head, I'm like, yeah, I'm she's because I knew her dreams were to retire in the Navy. She always wanted to do 20. I didn't want to do 20. So yeah, but while I was there, um I was of course, like I started dating, you know, and then uh I started learning some few things.

Gary Wise 57:55

Hey, hey, hey, you gotta get out there and get a group too, and get along with that.

Nelle Kigembe 58:01

You know, I started growing, and then uh uh my son's dad, when I met him, he was on a financial stuff, so he started teaching me things, but not what I do now, but it was more into hey, why you stay in an apartment? You needed to buy a house. And I told him, I can't afford to buy a house, right? And he and I told him, I'm like, you know, when I joined the Navy, I really didn't know about credit cards and all that. So I would apply for credit card, I would get the credit cards, and then the address was going back to my mom's house, so I wasn't paying them on time, I didn't really know that process. And here, when you miss 30 days on a credit card, they give you a red mark. You miss 60 days, give you red mark. So eventually you end up clearing it, but you don't know it tarnish your credit score. So by the time I realized that, I re-enlisted and I went to Washington State. When I realized that was the first time I realized my credit score was not too good. The good thing, because I re-enlisted, I had money, so I could pay whatever the tenant said, you needed to put down two months' rent. I have it. So it was like a blessing, and I wasn't doing much. So one of the civilians in the office um was telling me, like, Nelly, you can refinance your you can refinance all the credit cards that you messed up. Go to Navy Faro, they'll give you the consolidation loan, and you can pay all these high interest credit cards that you are paying and enjoy your life on show duty. So I went to Navy Faro and they gave me the consolidation loan.

Gary Wise 59:39

Yeah.

Nelle Kigembe 59:39

So I could breathe a little bit. You know, I had this one big loan, my car included. Uh, I could breathe. Then when I met my son's dad, he was telling me, like, you know, you came from Norfolk to Washington and you are still renting. So I was explaining him like all these things are new to me. Like, it has to take a person who has done something to teach me. And if that opportunity is not there, I don't know. So, what do I needed to do to position myself? So someday when I leave here, I can buy a house. So he started teaching me what I needed to do, and then I got pregnant.

Gary Wise 1:00:18

Okay, right. Um, were you at what point did you stop sending home money back to help take care of your mom? Did that stop while you were on the Kearsarge, or did that stop when you went to a lot of young sailors did that, right? And so I I understand that's a hard thing to stop, but you also at some point you gotta realize you have to live your life, right?

Nelle Kigembe 1:00:41

So yeah, it stopped when we when I became uh E5, and of course I was going to Washington State, and Nora was gonna have her own life, so we're like, okay, now we need to take care of our expenses, and at that time, um, my baby brothers were a little bit grown, so good. Yeah, my mom had a good job, so it was it was easier.

Gary Wise 1:01:04

Well, look, you you know, like I know, I've I've counseled lots of young sailors that were sending money home, but they would almost always get to that point where they were like, I need to start stop doing that because I've got to start building my own life going forward, and that's always a difficult transition, right? So okay, so now when you did when you decided to start your family, were you surprised that you were having a baby? What did it catch you

Pregnancy, Promotion, And Staying Navy

Gary Wise 1:01:28

off guard?

Nelle Kigembe 1:01:28

Yeah, it caught me off guard because really at that time I was um I was I was you know I was going to school, I wanted to become a nurse, right? Because I knew like uh back home I wanted to become a doctor, but now I was like, there's no way I want to do doctor, it's gonna take, you know, I'm not oh I'm not young anymore, it's gonna take me long. That's what I was saying myself. So I was like, maybe I can do the RIN registered nurse. So I applied to all the Dominion Universities University for RIN program, and they accepted me with a condition I needed to do the prerequisites for nursing. So I was going to Olympic college using tuition assistant just to do the prerequisiting for yeah, because I was already accepted. I think I still have that letter to to this day on my island, but um, so I knew we both knew, like, hey, they we are having fun, no kids because we are not there, you know. Yeah, but things happen, I drop the ball, you know.

Gary Wise 1:02:34

Nah, I got a life be life in man. But here you are, you're you're you're a second-class petty officer, about first, you're you're a hard charger, you're going to college, yeah. You could take you you can handle stuff like this. So uh when you when your baby comes, does that extend you longer at Bremerton?

Nelle Kigembe 1:02:57

Yeah, so when when the baby comes, um here, I don't know if it's we were going through the emotions of pregnancy. I couldn't stand the baby's dying. He has been having these conflicts. My master chief is mad because he didn't know I was dating him. You know, we were all on the same command, and I kept it secret as long as I could. So he was a sailor too. Yes, as long as I could until one day I had to go to the gun shoot, and then I had to reveal it because I was like, I don't want to be on all these things and then uh jeopardize the baby's safety just because I don't want Master Chief to know. I felt like Master Chief was like my dad, you know.

Gary Wise 1:03:43

Oh, I'm sure. Look, you again, you again, we love our people, right? And there's a little piece of us were like, really? You my personal team, it's the same way for me now with my students, right? My young females are come tell me, Master Chief, just so you know, I kind of mean I'm just like, Oh man, can't you keep it out of the ROTC program? What the heck? But you know, you the people you got proximity, right? You got people you're around, they get connected. Okay, so uh Master Chief finds out. Um but so how far were you through that tour? Were you like there for a year and a half, two years, and then you find out you're having the baby?

Nelle Kigembe 1:04:28

Yeah, so I was there on my last um on my last year, and I knew I wasn't gonna re-enlist, but this whole time I didn't tell anybody I wasn't gonna re-enlist because I didn't want people to view me like, okay, you're dropping a ball because you're not reenlisting. So I wanted to maintain the standards just in case. And I tell people, I used to tell even myself, even if you know you want to get out, just continue to perform because you never know when you change your mind. Because I knew I changed my mind. But the good thing, I maintained the standards, and uh, when I couldn't stand this man anymore, and I was like, Oh my gosh, what am I gonna do? Because now I'm gonna be a single parent, and the advancement uh results for e6 came up and I picked up, so I was like, uh, you you love me, you must love me. Okay, so I picked up E6 and I said, you know what? If I can pick up E6, I was young, I picked up E6 seven years in, right? So for CS at that time, it was a big deal because the minimum final multiples was 212, and I got 212, like right there on the cutoff.

Gary Wise 1:05:45

So I get it, you know what when the year I made chief or the year I made DC one, only seven of us made it in the entire Navy, so I was like in the 99th. Percentile of that test, right? If I hadn't have made DC one that year, I wouldn't have made chief when I made chief, right? So I can 100% relate to those moments. So you're pick up CS1 and you are you able to just was PTS a thing at this point in time? Was that a did you have to? But you're an E6 now, so now that's not a problem for you, right?

Nelle Kigembe 1:06:25

That's not a problem. So now I know for sure I'm gonna make a name in my career because I cannot have a child, ghost nursing, uncertainty, right? I was like, at least one thing I know, I love my job, I'm good at my job, you know, and I'm an E6. So what worse can it happen? I can retire 20, the baby will be a little bit older. So I'd rather stay with the navy that I know than to take a chance to go start something new and bring this issue to my sister.

Gary Wise 1:06:59

Okay.

Nelle Kigembe 1:07:00

So I call my mentor and I told my mentor, um, I would like to stay in, you know. And uh he told me, okay, now that you want to stay in, once you have a baby, he told me what will the happiness like the Navy chances I will extend you there until when the baby is one, then you're gonna pick up a ship. And he said, When you get a chance to pick up a ship, you're gonna go to a DDG. Yeah, and I said, Okay, and I said, Why DDG? And they said, Because DDG is gonna teach you leadership because I know you from the case, I know what you are doing on a show duty, you are admin, you need to know how to lead food service, and DDG is the right platform that can expose you to that.

Gary Wise 1:07:41

Okay, so you you and I they're right, you know, they're they're right, but then that also brings the complication of someone's gotta help you watch your child when you're deployed on that DDG, right? So, does your sister is she still in the Navy at this point in time as well?

Nelle Kigembe 1:07:57

So, my sister, she she was she my sister at that time, actually. So, at that time, I'm calling my sister, right? And I'm telling my sister about the news, and my sister said, You know what, Nelly? I'm about to separate. And I said, Huh, now you're supposed to do 20 years. If you're gonna separate, I'm gonna re-enlist because yeah, so we kinda swap it.

Gary Wise 1:08:25

I I'm not surprised. I kind of felt like that was gonna that was coming, right?

Nelle Kigembe 1:08:30

Uh, I mean, just okay, so so she gets out of the service, she gets out, and I was I was so sad, Gary, because Nora was uh senior sailor of the year for Naval Based Norfolk, right? Everybody's projecting this lady's gonna pick up Chief first time up, right? And here she is, she wants to let it be, right?

Gary Wise 1:08:53

Yeah, and I'm gonna walk, yeah, they gotta walk their walk, right? I mean, I've seen plenty of people do it, it would even be harder if they were my sibling, right? But what are you gonna do? So when you get orders to your DDG, do you go to a DDG next?

Nelle Kigembe 1:09:10

Yes, so I got the orders, you know. DDG, they're always one first class, so I was able to be selected to the call, USS Call. Okay, so I got an onboard call. My son was one at a time, and call was right there in Hampton Roads. So my sister is there in Norfolk. I told Nora now that I consolidated my my loans, I was able to pay them off while I was on show duty. I saved money $20,000, you know. So got to Norfolk, I bought the house and I told Nora, let's rent your house, come live in my house, help me with my son. Don't worry about the bills, just take care of your son and my son while I'm doing this C stuff. So that's what we did. We put Nora's house on the market for we didn't put it on the market, we put it for rent, right? So she got a tenant and she was taking care of the kids. Actually, my son thought I was auntie, and Nora was mom.

Gary Wise 1:10:09

That's you know what's so amazing about that, though, is that was what you were gonna do for your sister. You were gonna get out of the navy and go help her, but now it's just worked out that God He worked it out to where she could now be there to help you and your son, right? Yes, well, that's a great opportunity, and so now the two of you are living together and you're on the USS Cole. And what what is it now, like 2005, 2006?

Nelle Kigembe 1:10:35

You're now is 2000 and um, let me

USS Cole Leadership And Making Chief

Nelle Kigembe 1:10:39

see. Actually, call I was there 2009.

Gary Wise 1:10:42

Nine, okay, yes, yeah, okay. So from nine till two, did you do three years on board the call?

Nelle Kigembe 1:10:49

I did three years on board the call, and I picked up Chief on a call.

Gary Wise 1:10:53

How did you like Chief's initiation?

Nelle Kigembe 1:10:56

It was great, it was awesome.

Gary Wise 1:10:59

Did you enjoy it?

Nelle Kigembe 1:11:00

I enjoyed it, you know, and actually I feel like I had it better because we were out to see, so there was so much of training that can be done on that DDG because the next year when I was the chief and see it being done for you know, I was like, Oh, thank god I was out to see. You always love me, God.

Gary Wise 1:11:19

Hampton Rhodes is a lot going on for chiefs. Yes, so do you remember uh when you would come in gate 3A, there's a training building right across the street from that big grind, that parade ground right there, and the CSs teach class up there, right? Like on the third floor. And I used to teach school down the hall from there at the damage control school, but yeah, I was and I was there 2013 till 2016. Wow, right. But I will just tell you, a lot of chief stuff happened on that base uh during the chief season. So yeah, going through initiation underway was actually not a bad thing.

Nelle Kigembe 1:12:00

It was not a bad thing, although at the time I didn't know, you know, right, yes, yeah. But uh uh one thing I want to say like uh when I got to the call, um food service was not a problem. There were some adjustments I needed to know, but um the challenges on a call was the deck watches because on a on a casear, I never stood back watches. I was in the gallery, then I was watch captain in the gallery, I was a baker, right? I was on five and two rotation. The CSs have, then I went to show duty, I just picked up rank so fast. So here now I am uh first class on a DDG and I'm not ODQA. I don't even know what do you mean, OODQA.

Gary Wise 1:12:50

Yeah, you know, so but that's pretty common for MSs, right? They don't typically go to deck watches tell her about E6s, right? Typically, you're off the duty section because you're because you have your own rotations, right?

Nelle Kigembe 1:13:05

Yeah, so through my experience, I did better for the CS. Um, once I picked up Chief because you got them the exposure to it to it fast. When you're E5, I'll put you on duty section, yeah. Because I didn't want them to find out when they are E6.

Gary Wise 1:13:22

No, that's good. And I I they that DCPO, 3M managers, right? Like those are the sailor things that'll bite you, and they're not they're not quite MS things, but they're very important to the ship's success. Yes, and you don't want S2 to be dragging everybody down, right? No, I love MSs. I I would love to having you in my mess because you and I would think exactly right the same way because you're you're a black shoe sailor, right? Like you are a surface sailor, I get it.

Nelle Kigembe 1:13:55

No, I get it, yes, yeah. So it was challenging for that because uh I used to think my section leader just didn't like me. You know, I used to do colors as a CS1, he would put me on colours, and I didn't know why. Would you put me on colors or every time it's junior people? But you know at duty section, I'm the first one who's doing colors, right?

Gary Wise 1:14:17

He's just trying to prove a point, right?

Nelle Kigembe 1:14:18

He's just trying to, you're a you're a first-class petty officer, and and it took me a long time to learn, yeah, you know, like uh messenger, I would be messenger, so I was like, Oh, you know, duty section after hours, I'll be the one the first class who's actually over there painting the ship because he wouldn't even allow me to lead the duty section, he would want me to get the brush, CS1, and I'll be there doing so. This one time my my my chief was asking me, How's duty section? And I say, I think senior chief hates me. I'm like, and he said, Senior freak, he hates you. I'm like, yeah, because he always does this, he doesn't give me opportunity for this, and he said, Okay, I'll go find out what's wrong. Then he came back and he's like, Okay, let's have a chat. Then he started telling me the expectation of a first class on a DDG, and I said, Oh my gosh, why he didn't tell me to me, I wanted him to make a plane, but that was his way of making it plane.

Gary Wise 1:15:23

Yeah, no, it's and I can see that. I could I can feel that coming, and and look, it's one of our challenges, as in particular the surface navy community. I think that everyone's a little different in their own way, the aviation side, the carrier side, the submarine side, surface leaders can be can be not the best communicators, right? And they can just expect you to figure it out, or they'll you know the beatings will continue until morale improves, right? And as a CMC, I had to learn how to bring everyone together and to have these conversations and the mentorship, right? Tell this, tell this first class petty officer whether they're not meeting your expectations, and find out if it's are they trying to not do good or they just don't know, right? Um, and I could see you having that again. You you went to shore duty as a E5, and again, you're a high performer, you got two warfare pins, but now you you were an MS, right? Not everybody, and not everybody also understands the different communities, right? Like if you're yeah, some engineers, for example, they never again. My job as the CMC was to get everyone to respect everyone else in the mess, yes, right? That's it, right? We all we all need each other's support to pass SMA or to the NA or whatever it is, right? Yes, so uh when you look back on the coal, um, and you're leaving that ship as a chief petty officer. What do you think was your biggest leadership takeaway? Because you went there to learn leadership, right? That's what they told you to go do. What do you think was your biggest leadership takeaway? I like the one where you said you got your sailors involved earlier in the deck watches, right?

Nelle Kigembe 1:17:09

Yeah, yes. So the biggest takeaway was uh you gotta know your craft because you never know when you're gonna be put into a test. I only knew food service, but DDG gave me opportunity to be a leader, right? To know everything else. That hey, although you are just first class, the expectation is bigger than just the CS, it's bigger than just a supply, is bigger than just a command because you are first class period officer. So learning that early, it helped me when I picked up chief. Because at that time, when I knew what is expected out of me, Gary, I went and put it into work. I told my sister, hey, these two weeks, I want you to consider me being out to sea so I can get these calls done. Right. So we were on show, but I volunteered to tag along with OOD, volunteered tag along with other people that I needed to qualify. I was the number one person who was qualified all the way to art war when I became a chief. Good job. Yeah, because now I knew the expectation in leadership, right? So the same thing, like uh when I picked up a chief, I knew what is expected to become a chief. So, okay, this is what is expected out of us. Let's go do it. Because I already know Navy is my career. The good, the bad, the ugly, right? Get it done. Let's find a way to get it done, let's get it done. So that kind of helped me out. So I knew in order to become a good leader, you really gotta know it all. Like be flexible to learn it, adapt it, right? Because that's leadership is bigger than just what you do. That was my biggest takeaway.

Gary Wise 1:19:02

Did you how long were you on board the ship before you went through Chiefs initiation?

Nelle Kigembe 1:19:09

Actually, I was on board from 2009 and then uh 2009 February. My son turned one, so I checked on board, you know, like your transfer, 30 days transfer. Uh March, I was uh I was on board, and then 2011 I picked up chief, but that was my second time the first time I didn't I didn't get selected, the second time, 20 uh 11. I picked up chief. Okay, and then uh because I would tell you, okay, and then my tour was more than three years, so from there when I picked up chief, I had a CSC on board already, so I went to finish up my tour on Vela Golf

Vela Gulf Turnaround Under Pressure

Nelle Kigembe 1:19:56

as a chief.

Gary Wise 1:19:56

Oh, no kidding. So you went over to the cruiser as a that was a good opportunity.

Nelle Kigembe 1:20:01

It was a very good opportunity, and that came with the challenges too, because TyCam, um TyCam for CS came to see me personally and said, I need you on that ship, and and the ship is in a bad condition when it comes to food service. I'm not gonna lie to you, your sister didn't do what she's supposed to do, but I need you to keep up the standards, and I said, I can do it. You know, so I went over there and then uh unfortunately some of our brothers and sisters in the fleet they were coming to visit me because they knew I just picked up chief, and they said, You need to tell the Tycom you cannot do this billet. And I was thinking, like, so I called my mentor. I don't know, I call my mentor, and my mentor was also SES mass master chief. You know, I call him and I'm like, hey, you know, people are telling me this. I'm like, how can I go tell Tycom? I'm like, me talk to Tycom, you know, who am I? And he said, you know what? Right, everybody knows the standards are law, so bring them up. And if you can bring them up, you can take any command on the fleet and you can upgrade the standards. And we did, we went to work, and I finished my tour there, and I said, if I don't pick up senior chief first time apps, I'm wrong.

Gary Wise 1:21:24

Yeah, now how long were did you get to be on the Vela Gulf?

Nelle Kigembe 1:21:30

For about two years.

Gary Wise 1:21:34

Yes, okay, so you got some good quality time to be on board that ship.

Nelle Kigembe 1:21:39

Yes, yeah, two years. Um, I met the great leaders and a great mentorship. So I grew up, right? Yeah, actually, I was very competitive in a mess.

Gary Wise 1:21:54

Oh, I have no doubt. I have no doubt. Yeah, uh, why do you think looking back on your career now, now that what you know in hindsight, why do you think those people were trying to get you to not take the orders to the fellow goals?

Nelle Kigembe 1:22:09

You know, I think like uh probably fear, I don't know. I always think fear because sometimes we we wear this thing in our mindset. Um, I don't want to say it's laziness, I want to say maybe it's fear. People don't believe if ship standards are too low, they can be raised. But because they don't believe on their abilities, they want to paint this picture to other people to where they can believe in themselves, either. I am so grateful. My mentor was strong in a mindset, was like you are the one. If there's anyone on a fleet who can bring those standards up for food services, you and if you fail, who cares? We know where the ship was. But if you can bring those standards, yeah, yeah.

Gary Wise 1:23:05

So you think the people that did not want you to go that were afraid for you to not be successful?

Nelle Kigembe 1:23:13

I think so.

Gary Wise 1:23:14

Okay, yeah, hey man, those are my favorite opportunities, Dre. I love it when there's nowhere to go but up. Those are my favorite opportunities, exactly. Those are my favorite opportunities. Hey, I'm sorry if there's a delay on your side with the video or whatever it is. I don't know what's going on on my internet, but I I can hear you loud and clear, just so you know.

Nelle Kigembe 1:23:36

Okay, okay, yes. I think of the same way. There's uh there's a little bit of slowdown.

Gary Wise 1:23:43

Yeah, I'm not sure what's going on. I'm not, I think if my son jumped on the internet or something like that, but it could be my son too. So you you're leaving, so you're leaving the Vela Gulf, you're up for senior chief probably, and you're competitive for senior chief. Where do you take orders to after the Vela Golf?

Nelle Kigembe 1:24:05

So I was not up for senior chief yet. And then so here comes.

NAVSUP HQ To Senior Chief Lessons

Nelle Kigembe 1:24:11

I want to stay in Virginia because I had I had Nora to help me with my son, right? Right, and then the detailer is telling me I needed to go to Italy. Oh, I needed to go to Pennsylvania, and I said, What's in Italy? And they said it is a flag mess, and I said, I'm not a flag mess chief, I'm a surface ship, right? I'm a surface chief, you know, so I can't go and relearn on a flag mess as a chief. Give me the fleet. So I wanted, I was willing to do double back-to-back sea to stay in Virginia, but there was no billet for me. So he said you needed to go on shore, so we need you a nap uh in Pennsylvania. And I said, What's in Pennsylvania? He said that that's where NAFSA headquarters is. So I said, Okay, I'll take Pennsylvania. So I called my mentor and I was like, Hey, I'm going to Pennsylvania, and my mentor was super excited. And then I got to Pennsylvania, NAFSAP headquarters, and then I called my mentor again, and I'm like, man, all the senior chiefs here telling me this is a dead billet, you know, because there's no junior people, right? There's no junior people. It's like if you think you're gonna get salarization here, is you can forget it, is so much senior officers. I've never worked with so many senior officers, including Admiral, in the building, like when I was in NAVSAP headquarters in Pennsylvania, Mechanics Bank, right?

Gary Wise 1:25:47

Right.

Nelle Kigembe 1:25:47

So I'm calling my mentor. My mentor is like, that's the top of the spear, that's where you want to be. Right, yeah. So, and he told me, he's like, that's where the publications are written. You get to learn how the publications are written, you get to get yourself involved with the civilians who have been there for so many years because who knows that these are the civilians who will help you in the future. You need to thrive in that billet, right? And then I'm checking in with my CMC. I'm telling my CMC the same concerns, and my CMC is telling me you need a senior enlisted academy, and he's telling me the same thing what my mentor was telling me. Yeah, he's like you needed to take advantage of anything, anything that the master chiefs, the senior chiefs on the fleet are bringing to NAFSA. You need to be in that room on those conversations because you just came from the fleet and be able to communicate those needs to the civilians so they can understand. And I did that.

Gary Wise 1:27:00

You know, I went to a billet as well as a chief, and everyone told me there that it was a dead billet, there's no leadership, no sailorization. I had a phenomenal tour, right? I had an amazing tour, and what I've learned throughout my life, it's not about what everyone tells you is gonna happen, it's about what you decide is going to happen and how you best help things along, right? Because you've got to bring something to the conversation, you've got to put the work in, you've got to seek out, like you said, you got to seek out your mentor, you've got to get the different perspectives. So I'm just not surprised, Nelly, to hear that you were successful there, right? It just doesn't, it just doesn't surprise me. And I concur that that is a phenomenal place for you to become a leader in your rate and in your supply organization because now you're learning about all of the most important decisions that are coming down the pipe. Now, do you do the whole three years?

Nelle Kigembe 1:28:00

There, I wish Gary.

Gary Wise 1:28:05

See, I'm not surprised. I'm not surprised. That's why I asked it that way. I'm not what happened. Tell Gary what happened.

Nelle Kigembe 1:28:13

So I picked up senior chief first year, was there, but I knew that was Velagof work. And then um my CMC was able to help me to go to senior enlisted academy. And then two years on that tour, they needed someone to return back to see, and I was the best candidate to return back to see early. But at that time, uh I told CMC like Senior Enlisted Academy. It was uh 2014, yeah, 2014.

Gary Wise 1:28:51

Was it 20? What class were you?

Nelle Kigembe 1:28:54

I was uh who 120 something gold. I need to check 124.

Gary Wise 1:29:00

Okay.

Nelle Kigembe 1:29:01

Yes.

Gary Wise 1:29:02

Okay, because I was 190 gold. Okay.

Nelle Kigembe 1:29:05

Okay, yeah.

Gary Wise 1:29:07

Right. So so you go to the SCA and you residential promotes go back to sea.

Nelle Kigembe 1:29:14

Yeah. Yeah. And I want to go to a carrier because I've never done a carrier at that point. I did the LHD, I did the DDG, I did the cruiser. So now I'm like, if you're gonna return me back to sea, I wanna go to a carrier. And then here's Master Chief is telling me, Edeller Master Chief is telling me that's not how it works when you get selected to go back to sea early. We got a platform for you, a DDG. We need you, senior chief, over there, and I'm like, uh, oh man, in my head, I'm like, oh man, I'm never gonna make Master Chief because the board is gonna think I'm too comfortable with the DDG, you know.

Gary Wise 1:29:56

Yep, yeah, I do. I know.

Nelle Kigembe 1:29:58

So I'm telling my CMC, you gotta do something to help me because DDG, this is gonna be the end of my career. And then he told me, he told me, look, they return you back to sea, so we're gonna capture it that they return you back to sea. And this is the billet, it's not like you wanted to go to a DDG, the Navy wants you to go to DDG, right? Yeah, so I went to DDG and I picked a master chief on that DDG, but I knew that was well, and that's that's yeah, yeah.

DDG Orders, Hawaii, And Master Chief

Gary Wise 1:30:30

That's smart strategy from the Master Chief to know to write that in your email, yeah. And I'm sure when you got to the destroyer, you were a leader in the mess immediately, and and there you go. So, yes, what DG did you go to?

Nelle Kigembe 1:30:44

To William P. Lawrence.

Gary Wise 1:30:48

Are they in Hawaii? Where were they? Are they in Hawaii?

Nelle Kigembe 1:30:51

They're in Hawaii now. When I got the orders, they were here in San Diego, and then we did home post shift right after the deployment, and we went to Hawaii. And when I picked up Master Chief, I said yes, I need to pick up Master Chief, right? Because this will be my way out of BBG, right? I can get to do the carry. Yeah, I wanted I wanted that carry experience so much, Gary.

Gary Wise 1:31:17

I hear you, man. I that's that I did it. That was what made me a master, was an aircraft carrier, so I can I can relate. Was Nora traveling with you, still watching your son?

Nelle Kigembe 1:31:29

No, so Nora Nora got married, and then when I got yeah, when I got orders to Pennsylvania, something happened with my mom. So I told my mom, hey, since you are selling your home, since they laid you off, you can uh come live with me. So my my mom was able to play a major role in Pennsylvania because she was watching William, and now I was able to do the work I was supposed to do that senior chief in NAPSAP, they were not able to do, is traveling to go do several assessments uh of the galleys of uh schools that we needed uh CS to have opportunity to go. I was being sent to be foot on the ground ears to make sure, hey, what they're gonna teach will they to really be useful for the fleet for our CS. So in a way, it helped me out. Yeah, so my mom was there, and then when I got orders to come to California, my son's dad lives in San Diego, so I told him, Hey, I need you to help me with uh with uh William, and uh I'm on a DDG. The DDG is about to deploy, and then he's doing home post shift, and then once I get to Hawaii, once I get situated, I can watch the baby, yeah.

Gary Wise 1:32:55

Right, and I and he and he was able, he was good to go to do that. That's awesome.

Nelle Kigembe 1:33:00

He yes, he was able to do that, and then uh I was able to I went to Hawaii, the ship was in a shipyard, so I was able to spend time with William, and then until when the ship became operational again, and then I sent William back to his dad, and then I finished up my tour, and then uh and things didn't work out like the way I was thinking that once I picked up my master chief, I'm gonna get to a better platform, a bigger platform, a career, because Hawaii is a dod tour, and that's something I didn't know. Yeah, if it's a did two dour, you have to spend three years on that island.

Gary Wise 1:33:44

So they made you stay on the ship for three years after the home port shift.

Nelle Kigembe 1:33:48

Yes, yes, that's incredible. Yeah, because uh yeah, but um the good thing, once I finished that tour, the billet the billet opened here in San Diego as a force master chief, and I took that billet.

Gary Wise 1:34:06

So where was the force at? Was that at Surface Forces Pacific?

Nelle Kigembe 1:34:10

Come now, South Park, yeah. Commander Naval Surface Force U.S. Pacific Fleet.

Gary Wise 1:34:17

Okay. Is that where you retired

SurfPac COVID Grind And Burnout

Gary Wise 1:34:19

from?

Nelle Kigembe 1:34:19

That's where I retired from, and the reason I retired because COVID hit when I was a force CS. You know, now I have responsibility for all the surface ships from San Diego to Washington to Guam, all the way to Japan, right? And COVID hit while I'm a force CS.

Gary Wise 1:34:40

Right.

Nelle Kigembe 1:34:41

Yeah, so I gave the fleet my cell phone numbers because you know the mission doesn't stop just because we were going through COVID. The ships were still deployed, the sailors were still getting sick. So I gave my personal cell phone number to the fleet. So it was constant ringing, constant solving issues because I want to make sure I keep my captain in check and we keep admiral informed. So I worked like a donkey and I got exhausted.

Gary Wise 1:35:13

I didn't have no area. Look, I was the naval-based Guam CMC during COVID, right? So remember all the ships coming to Guam, getting all their food and getting everything delivered. So so and I retired off of Guam. I retired in 2022. Me too, and at 25 years in the Navy, and I was I was exhausted, right? I was I was that people have no idea how much work it took to keep the fleet going during a pandemic, right? Yes, so you were at Surface Force Pacific. Was uh I was trying to think, was Aurora over there with you at SurfPak? Robles Aurora Aurora Robles, was she there with you? Was she there at Surf Pack?

Nelle Kigembe 1:36:06

Maybe, maybe, maybe, I don't know.

Gary Wise 1:36:09

She's a QM Master Chief. So she might have got there after you. Okay. Maybe, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, she's a her family's good friend of mine. Eli is the her husband. He's over at ATG right now in San Diego. So when you decided to retire, um, did you know uh that you wanted to get and to become an entrepreneur?

Retirement Pivot Into Financial Education

Nelle Kigembe 1:36:38

No way. So let me tell you, here I am exhausted. So is my assistant who is a civilian, also want to retire. And I say, God, you must really love me again, like this whole time. The opportunity just keep following me. So I told my assistant, civilian, how if I apply for your job? Because I'm getting relieved with the master chief, and I get to help the master chief. So, okay, we talked is a government contracting job. So we talked to the project manager, and project manager was like, You don't need an interview. I know you, Nelly. The job is yours. I just need your resume, though. So I gave him my resume. I knew I was gonna start because I retired August of 2022, so I knew I was gonna start August 2022, and then my assistant he called me and he said, Nelly, I'm gonna extend it until November. So I said, Yeah, sure, you can extend it. But here in between, right, uh, if you remember during a pandemic, um, we were accumulating uh leave days, so I took, I had like 110 days of terminal leave, right? So here in between, during terminal leave time, I was looking on my finances for the first time. I thought I was doing good in finances, so I'm trying to understand it. I'm making phone calls. I want the companies that have my money to actually educate me because now I have time to learn, and uh, I didn't really get the education I was looking for, so I was searching for education because I have time, and my brother, Wema, the one who never joined the military because three of us did, except for him, he's a truck driver, right? So he was telling me, Nelly, you are so military conditioned. I need to introduce you to financial professionals. They are the ones who do education when it comes to money. So I said, Okay, connect me. I have time. So when that guy came, he really took time for like one hour pouring information to me. It looks like a new information. I'm like, wait a minute, you telling me money works it this way in America? How come we don't know? You know, so I told him, I have time. What can I do to get your knowledge? And they say, Oh, Nelly, you just needed to license and pass a state of California exam and get your license, then I will teach you. And I said, Show me where to start and how to start. So he showed me a kiduna two weeks later. I passed that test and I waited for my license. And when when Andrew, my my assistant at the time, when he extended to November, I said, I'm gonna start educating people about their money, and I'm gonna focus on my community, which is military and veterans, because that's the only community I knew since I came to America. Yeah, and I fell in love in education. So when November came, and um my um Andrew was reminding me, like, hey, I'm getting ready. I said, you know what? Find someone else for that job. I love food service, but now I found my passion, my calling. I don't want to touch just food service, I want to touch everyone I need.

Gary Wise 1:40:10

Very cool.

Nelle Kigembe 1:40:12

Yeah.

Gary Wise 1:40:12

So in the financial services space, what is your favorite part? Is it is it budgeting? Is it investing? Is it it? What is your specialty in that space when you help people? Is it just education across the board for people?

Nelle Kigembe 1:40:32

Is education across the board, Gary? You know, like um all kinds of accounts that we use every day, checking, savings, whatever the account that you use, that education piece. But the piece I love the most is the protection piece. Because I tell people like this if you are building a house, it's great. You can build your house, right? But if you are not protecting that house, I don't know what you're doing. So if we are working hard to make money, it's great. But if we're not protecting that income, something is wrong, right? That nobody told us that I needed to protect my income. But if you are working hard to build your legacy that you can pass down to your family members, if you don't know how to protect that legacy, it may not go to your family members like the way you think is gonna go, because there are rules in place, and Cosem already put them in place, and people are coming to find out way too late, right?

Gary Wise 1:41:39

So we think so. You're talking about like like trust planning and stuff like that, right?

Nelle Kigembe 1:41:46

Exactly, because you know, like uh the navy is great, I love it. I really hope someday they can switch from us using living trust to us use from us using living will to us using living trust, you know, right because will is good, but we are not really protecting our legacy through will, and people don't know that hey, we I gotta have something else that can that I can easily pass my legacy to my family, so that kind of education is what I do.

Gary Wise 1:42:24

So for just so I could for my own information, because I do have a living trust, my wife and I set up a living trust, and all of our things, god forbid, if we were to pass away, would flow into the living trust, right? Very good. Um and so then I have executors of the living trust that are adults that would manage that for on behalf of my children, right? But is that just because we're gonna get taxed no matter what, right? But is it taxed differently because it's going into the trust than if it was just going directly to my children?

Nelle Kigembe 1:43:00

So that talking about the tax part, I'm gonna be able to, I'm I'm gonna disclose this. I'm not attorney, right? Okay, so yeah, but I do have access to attorneys that they don't charge to educate our communities, right? So they give them 30 minutes and educate them. So I tell our people, I connect you to attorneys, don't go over there just to listen to them because you have 30 minutes for free. Bring questions like that.

Gary Wise 1:43:30

Oh, yeah.

Nelle Kigembe 1:43:30

But the way the living trust is, even if you're gonna pass it to your family members, that living trust needed to be funded. And most of the time it gets funded later on. So they'll be able to tell you the best strategy, how you can be able to fund it to minimize that tax stuff.

Gary Wise 1:43:49

Okay, interesting. I mean, I said we set we set that up ourselves, right? Through like legal zoom or something like that. Um, but we just did that because ease of all of like TSP cashing out, ease of life insurance policies cashing out, and my children not being old enough to make those decisions. So no, no, that's amazing. So, who is your target customer for in 2026? Right, you've been doing this now for three, four years. Who is the person? Because when I found you, I found you using social media, yeah, right. And I'm just curious to know, like, what is your goal with your social media presence? Because my goal, just so you know, sis, my goal is to be easier to find for the people that are looking for me. That's my goal, right? I want to be easier to find. I want to be putting, I want to put myself in a position that the people that are looking for me can find me because of the things I offer from from my own entrepreneurial journey. I have a leadership development business, right? I offer a lot of different leadership development things, which is like my side job outside of what I do for day work, but the internet is the easiest way to kind of advertise to the world, right? Is that kind of why you started the the to do your stuff online?

Nelle Kigembe 1:45:17

Yes, but uh, you know, one thing I realized too. Yes, I want people to find me, but um, because my idea people are active duty and veterans, because I know how it is to be active duty, and I know how it is to be a veteran now, and I know what's lacking, and with the information I have, I know exactly what my community doesn't know because when I'm getting told, right? But I unfortunately in a financial industry for the license that I have, regulations, I can't come in a public and teach people the exact it, right? Because it's heavily regulated. So what I do to advertise myself is mostly is through referrals, and even when I come, I will talk about it, but I wouldn't go in details because it's against the regulations. Oh no kidding, no kidding, yes. That's a tough product to sell, you can't sell it because the way, yeah, exactly, because the way to sell it is through education, not selling like I'm selling chapstick, right? Yeah, it's through education so people can make informed decisions.

Gary Wise 1:46:36

So you know, I think, yeah, I I I hear you, and everything we do in life is about educating people and trying to show them that you're the person that has access to the information that can help them improve their life. So, how can I best, how can I and my listeners, how can we best help you?

Nelle Kigembe 1:46:57

Yeah, so the best to help me is for you guys to come and listen to one of our financial awareness, right? We do financial awareness Monday through Saturday, and these complimentary free. Because sometimes when people see free, they take it for granted. Then when something is wrong, that's when they find me and I'm like, it's too late. I can give you some recommendation, but there's nothing I can do, you know. So every day we have a leader who teaches the same financial awareness. I just teach Monday because I live in California, in San Diego. So I teach Monday at 3 p.m. Uh time, right? Eastern time, but it's 12 p.m. my time. And I teach on Thursday at 3 p.m. Pacific time, which is 6 p.m. U.A. time. But if someone says I'm off on Wednesday, we have another leader teaching on Wednesday, you know. So the best way for anyone who's listening to me is just text me on the phone, then I'll schedule you, right? Because if we were on the Zoom, I could be like, here's the website, go and uh and register yourself. But text me or find you, Gary, and be like, hey, how can we get in touch with Nelly? Right.

Gary Wise 1:48:15

So what I need for sure is the information so I can put it in the video stuff. Okay, right. So when I post this video on YouTube, and then um just make sure you're connected with my leadership solutions, Word from the Wise podcast Facebook page. And because a bunch of these videos are gonna get cut up into like short clips, and you can take those and then share them and make sure you put your information in the comment box as well, right? For people that are looking for you, because I will tell you uh financial management planning is how I got into it was I became a command financial specialist, right, as a first class petty officer. And then, of course, I got access to people in the military that were all making money moves, right? I met a lot of people in the Navy that were doing good things, and I agree. I mean, I teach my students every year, I teach them the I taught the book Rich Dad, Poor Dad. I teach it every year in class, right? I teach them about financial readiness and planning, and so I definitely want to help get the message as far out as I can because I know that, like you were talking about earlier, the stress of carrying all this debt to all these different places and the pressure that was on you. I understand what that relief can bring to people as they're trying to figure out what their life is going to be like in the future, right? I can totally relate.

Parenting, Leadership, And Rapid Fire

Gary Wise 1:49:41

Thank you. Well, Delhi, no, no, we're about to we're about to land this thing, but before we do, I got some I got some quick questions for you. You ready? Yes. All right, here we go. Let's see. All right, what would what do you these what do you see is the biggest leadership challenge. facing organizations today.

Nelle Kigembe 1:50:05

Biggest challenge facing organization. Maybe Gary, I will say flexibility to adapt to a change.

Gary Wise 1:50:16

Sounds about right. Yeah. Yeah. People don't, yeah, that's a good one. Flexibility to adapt to change. And I don't think that's ever gonna go away. That's spot on. All right. So you like me, we raise children, right? Uh my I have an 11-year-old son and an 18-year-old son. Your son is probably an adolescent right about now, right? 18. 18. Okay. So a lot of my listeners are parents of teenagers, right? And that's one of my target markets is I want to work with parents on trying to raise teenagers because teenagers can be challenging, right? Yes. Um and and of course we had a leg up because we've been raising adults all of our adult life. Right. So so we had a leg up there. But what do you see is how can parents use leadership skills to better connect with and guide their their adolescent children.

Nelle Kigembe 1:51:14

Let me tell you I'll be honest that is is a still challenge for myself with my own son.

Gary Wise 1:51:21

Yeah.

Nelle Kigembe 1:51:22

Yeah because I'm looking at myself and I tell him like I have all these leadership skills not all in the military now in this business I'm leading team of 90 agents right but you are the most challenging of them all so like uh I don't know what advice I can give to the parents because uh at some point I feel like we just need to understand that uh our children are not our generation. You know one thing I look for my for my son to say what could I have done better to me personally I think I could have taken more time to understand his needs better.

Gary Wise 1:52:08

Because I'm always compare myself with him like hey I'm a girl you are a boy I was born in a different country you are born over here with all opportunity you are born citizen you know like so I have a negative way of parenting him and I shouldn't be comparing myself and him because we are two different people so what I was born in a different country so what he's born over here right like he can never be me so that piece of understanding him from where he is to me personally I'm lacking that right so my advice to the parents is like lower your standards because we are different breed from different generation and they are the new breed the same standards will not apply to them so do you want to hear something something so my son is 18 year old as well right but a lesson I learned when I became a command master chief what my standard as a DC senior chief and as a DC master chief was through the roof high right like I was you when you would see me as a DC senior chief master chief I was the guy with the super shiny boots creased up coveralls I was AJ squared away and people would always judge me because I'm an engineer but I look like I was in supply department right but I went mess cranking to laundry when I was a young sailor so I learned how to work the the laundry presses right but I want but I could turn the wrench better than most people I was a very good engineer a snipe right I'm a snipe but I wanted to stand out and I wanted to set this very high example and hold my sailors to this high standard when I went command master chief I literally lowered my personal standard to the navy standard right because I did not want people to be afraid to approach me to talk about things and I I could no longer just hold you to my own personal standard when my job was to uphold the Navy standard which was much lower than my own personal standard right and so I really learned how to meet people at at different areas because the thing about leadership is you've got to inspire people to to aspire to go to a higher level yes right and and that's where I think parents but but step one for parents they have got to be living already an inspired life where they're continuing to be aspirational because the example they're gonna give to their children is always going to mean more than what you tell them to do. Right now the second part of that is going to be is we have to remember where we were at at that age right and what we were doing and try to give the grace there because we now have the benefit and the other challenge is they're not our sailors right you you and I have mentored so many people that have found success and then you're just like why can I not do this with my own child but the reality is that's that's not our role right they have got to go out and find those other mentors that are out there for them to help them find success you know one of my prayers is that I hope my children just want to continue to be friends as we get older right but my wife has this amazing saying though my wife says but your future success is not a reflection on me. Right at some point that child is responsible for their own success so if my wife will tell my sons she'll be like look if you want to grow up and be a bum that is not a reflection on how I am as a mom or as a parent I did a damn good job right and so don't be too hard on yourself sis I'm just gonna give you that grace right and I tell that to a lot of parents right like at some point that kid's got to be able to stand up and handle business like a man or a woman and hopefully they want to continue to partner with you. But there's a difference between you know I when I looked at my parents as an adult my success level had gone so much higher and I love my mom and dad but I don't know that I would have ever called them to get me out of bed right I would call that mentor like you were calling yes all right so next one is uh if somebody's struggling in an organization right kind of like how you were towards the end of your career just exhausted or or they're just not happy whether it's a of you know like you were with that section leader that you felt like hated you um what's a piece of advice you would give to that person you know you somebody's listening to your voice and they're just thinking man how did she she made it the Master Chief and she on a DDG as an MS what would your advice be to that person you know I don't know but I want to say Gary is um in anything right there's a solution to any problem right I tell people if you have a headache there's a Tylenol that can take the headache away so you have to be willing to be coached to be willing to listen to advice to be willing to improve to be willing to grow because if you rebel that right you're gonna continue to get frustrated so if you know your goals and you know this is a hiccup because life will keep laughing right we already know that so what's the solution there's always a solution you may not see it reach out to someone else I did not know why the senior chief was treating me that way but my chief was able to tell me why right and I took it positive because my goal was to always be the best version of myself I love it I love it that's the best advice you can give to them and sometimes you got to go hear the the tough information because I I tell my students because look I'm a damage control master chief that became a command master chief right I'm an amphib gator sailor I am not the easiest guy to always be around but I'm preparing you to deal with people like me for the rest of your life and I love you to death I love you I just say I love you a different way right like get it done yes get it done okay we're gonna we're gonna get out of the deep questions we're gonna get into the fun ones real quick now all right it's saturday night we're underway you know what that means it's pizza or wings in the mess which one are you looking forward to pizza or wings wings all right my next question right so hey you know the difference we got birthing cleaners and we got working parties right and this is not a mess this is not a cs working party we got a working party for stores well it's all CS working parties dang it you were always in charge of the working parties so when you what would you rather do would you rather go clean the birthing or work on the working party oh I would clean the birthing Gary I am not mad at you for that I am not mad at you for that I understand okay we're gonna watch a movie tonight in the Chiefs mess would you rather watch a Robert De Niro movie or an Al Pacino movie Robert De Niro De Niro okay all right here's a good question looking back on your career what was your favorite Liberty port uh oh actually we were able to go to Paris when I was on a call yes I couldn't believe it was amazing it was a port near Paris so we took a tour in our tour we were right there in Paris guess what that's where our overnight Liberty cheat were in Paris guys that's incredible i you were the first person I've ever met that got a port visit in France like for Liberty that's like a world war two port visit you know I'm saying it was beautiful that's amazing okay looking back on your career or in your life you know what what was your hardest watch qualification the hardest one I want to say probably yes that's an important one that's a pretty high one too were you and and I'm sure you were a section leader as well right yes I was a section leader on a Velago on the call I was assistant section leader and guess what I was assistant section leader for the same synergy that's how that's how it's my student hey he was just getting you ready to be his assistant yes all right so uh I I asked this one often you got the chance to do three years in Hawaii plus you got all this time you had stateside so would you rather do Hawaii or would you rather do stateside again if you were to go back to sea me personally I rather do stateside okay just because Hawaii was challenging I'm a single parent you know yeah family members it was hard to get family members around me Hawaii is beautiful but I felt like I was alone with that kid so stepside is easy no I get it yeah I get it I get it all right do you have a favorite movie or television series oh Troy Troy Troy yes yes that's even my family member they're like you with a Troy I'm like that's me so you know they're making a a movie's coming out this summer that's like the sequel to Troy did you know that I didn't know yeah it's it's about the the you know Odysseus the Iliad and the Odyssey uh if it's so after the battle of Troy the Greek warriors are going back home and it's about their trip home so I was watching I told my sons I said if you guys want to watch that movie we got to watch Troy first so you understand how we got there but that Troy is a phenomenal movie thank you oh yeah it's amazing I appreciate it yeah yeah check that movie out all right uh would you rather be independent or on a team a team and a part of it is because you know uh from back in Tanzania we are community based so you know from the time we were raised up we were raised up to do um unity teamwork so maybe was the same thing team ethics teamwork so I will choose team all day long okay do you have a personal leadership philosophy?

Nelle Kigembe 2:03:18

Ah yes I do and um that philosophy has changed over the years but now my leadership philosophy I tell people we are all thriving to be success but success means little if the next generation is still struggling because we failed to teach them yeah yeah that's it I like it all right so in the Chiefs mess we have deck plate leadership institutional technical expertise professionalism character loyalty active communication and a sense of heritage right dip class you remember that yes um out of our guiding principles which one of those is your favorite my favorite has always been deck plate leadership because you will never find me in a mess you'll find me in that galley with my CSS or making my rounds I'm not surprised I love it all right would you would you rather lead or follow you know I don't mind following really because leadership is easy for me but I think I also you know I always believe like to be a great leader you gotta also be a great follower so I don't mind if my second class is a training PO and I'm gonna sit down like I'm a baby E1 hearing that training like raising my hand and all that I do not mind yeah I love it. All right uh that's it do you have any saved rounds or alibis yeah thank you so much Gary I am so grateful I was nervous to come over here because I'm like oh my gosh I'm not good on talking but then I'm like come on Nelly you're good on talking you know and I'm like it's Gary oh my gosh and I'm like Gary's your brother you know yeah but Gary I want to say thank you so much for taking time for inviting me for giving me this opportunity I'm truly honored thank you and I want to say the final words is your background may shape you but it does not have to limit you so for anyone who's listening to this just know like hey let's not use our background as an excuse because if you use that it will put you in a box we're in 2026.

Final Takeaway And How To Connect

Gary Wise 2:05:53

That's it all right Nelly you are spot on ladies and gentlemen this is Bagarian Nelly we've been on the Words from the Wise podcast if you like the words if you like the inspiration if you like the message please like and subscribe if you're interested in financial information andor education look for the information from Nelly we're gonna get that out there and we'll figure out to get you connected with her sis it was so much fun talking with you it was just like being back in the mess. Thank you so much for your time thank you Gary say hello to the family I sure will you too as well all right I'll talk to you later bye everybody